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Discussion
I think something like this would work;

Hart
Walker - Smalling - Cahill/ Jagielka - Baines
Gerrard/ Carrick - Wilshere
Walcott - Rooney - Young/ Lennon
Sturridge/ Welbeck
By Shola | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 14:03 PM
Not sure about Carrick, Cleverley & Wilshere being defensive enough. Maybe Jones or Rodwell in at DMC if they ever get fit and ready. (Behind Wilshere and Cleverley)

Joey Barton.
Twitter - @bakes_87
By ianbaker | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 15:03 PM
Joey Barton.




Wilshere was superb on Wednesday night, I think Welbeck will get better for England but as somebody pointed out he's wasted out on the left.
By Sam | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 16:17 PM


Wilshere was superb on Wednesday night, I think Welbeck will get better for England but as somebody pointed out he's wasted out on the left.

He is, but if we're going to employ a 4-2-3-1 formation with only one out-and-out striker, he needs to play more games for United through the middle and improve his finishing.
By Telegram Sam | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 16:19 PM
He is, but if we're going to employ a 4-2-3-1 formation with only one out-and-out striker, he needs to play more games for United through the middle and improve his finishing.


Yeah I agree, but I don't think that's going to happen anytime soon.
He's been playing well for us on the wing, he deserved a chance and I think his work rate was why he was in there too. Can't see Sturridge working as hard as him to keep Dani Alves silent for 70 mins.
I dont think Welbeck needs to improve his finishing, he's just having a bad season in front of goal.
By jumberto | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 16:46 PM
I dont think Welbeck needs to improve his finishing, he's just having a bad season in front of goal.

I agree, in a way, it's better than it has been recently.

But I don't think his finishing is usually much better than erratic even at it's best, definitely needs some consistency.

«This comment has been edited»
Yeah he's not what you'd call a natural finisher like Owen for example but he's more than capable and has scored some cracking goals already. Erratic is a good word for him, but consistency will come as he gets older. His record for a player his age is fine, well above average.

I'm sticking in the Welbeck will be very good camp and I'm confident he'll prove me right.
Not on the left he won't, which i think is/was the original argument.
http://www.liveonlineradio.net/wp-content/themes/Music_Covers/images/music2.gif -------- http://rs648.pbsrc.com/albums/uu204/JeWeL1980_photos/7505xjc54lf3np.gif~c200 -------- http://www.liveonlineradio.net/wp-content/themes/Music_Covers/images/music2.gif
He won't be a good player on the left?
By A Little Bit Of Merson Magic | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 16:59 PM
Not on the left he won't, which i think is/was the original argument.

That's purely dependent on what role you ask him to play on the left.

Absolutely no reason he can't perform in a similar vein to Thomas Müller, Pedro or David Villa out wide but he's certainly not built to play like a traditional winger.
I like Welbeck, but in an ideal world we need an out-and-out winger on the left hand side - I'd rather see someone like Oxlade-Chamberlain/ Lennon/ Young used there, as opposed to a striker played out of position. Welbeck works hard but doesn't strike me as particularly pacey or as someone who can take on full-backs and beat them in the same way that Walcott can. I think Welbeck's future with England should be as a striker but at the moment I'd probably favour Defoe or Sturridge over him.
I think Welbeck's off-the-ball work is pretty good, it's a bit like tracking James Milner. You'd think they're inferior because they're less likely to be on the highlight reel as a Chamberlain or a Sturridge, but defensively, they do their bit very well.
Gerrard isn't going to be dropped any-time soon, he is the captain after all.
By Telegram Sam | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 17:04 PM
I like Welbeck, but in an ideal world we need an out-and-out winger on the left hand side - I'd rather see someone like Oxlade-Chamberlain/ Lennon/ Young used there, as opposed to a striker played out of position. Welbeck works hard but doesn't strike me as particularly pacey or as someone who can take on full-backs and beat them in the same way that Walcott can. I think Welbeck's future with England should be as a striker but at the moment I'd probably favour Defoe or Sturridge over him.

Welbeck's definitely pacey.

«This comment has been edited»
By Jaygull | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 17:06 PM
I think Welbeck's off-the-ball work is pretty good, it's a bit like tracking James Milner. You'd think they're inferior because they're less likely to be on the highlight reel as a Chamberlain or a Sturridge, but defensively, they do their bit very well.

Chamberlain does work hard, to be fair. Ideally Hodgson will be able to drill that into him some more as he's faster and a better out-and-out winger than someone like Milner, but he just needs to improve his discipline some more.
By Telegram Sam | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 17:04 PM
I like Welbeck, but in an ideal world we need an out-and-out winger on the left hand side - I'd rather see someone like Oxlade-Chamberlain/ Lennon/ Young used there, as opposed to a striker played out of position. Welbeck works hard but doesn't strike me as particularly pacey or as someone who can take on full-backs and beat them in the same way that Walcott can. I think Welbeck's future with England should be as a striker but at the moment I'd probably favour Defoe or Sturridge over him.


All very good but you named 3 right footed players who will cut inside almost every time, therefore not traditional out and out wingers playing from the left.
By Ninja | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 17:03 PM
That's purely dependent on what role you ask him to play on the left.

Absolutely no reason he can't perform in a similar vein to Thomas Müller, Pedro or David Villa out wide but he's certainly not built to play like a traditional winger.


Muller maybe but he's nothing like the other two players mentioned, he's a centre forward certainly, but for me he offers absolutely nothing when on the left hand side. Not one part of his game is suited to play there and i would say his stats this season prove that.
http://www.liveonlineradio.net/wp-content/themes/Music_Covers/images/music2.gif -------- http://rs648.pbsrc.com/albums/uu204/JeWeL1980_photos/7505xjc54lf3np.gif~c200 -------- http://www.liveonlineradio.net/wp-content/themes/Music_Covers/images/music2.gif
By Ninja | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 17:07 PM
Welbeck's definitely pacey.

Yes, but he isn't able/ doesn't try to beat players like Walcott or Lennon can, can he?

I'm not slating him, I just don't think he's good enough to be our first-choice left winger as he doesn't possess the qualities to excel in that position - which isn't surprising considering the fact he's been played as a striker for the majority of his career.
By Jaygull | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 17:06 PM
I think Welbeck's off-the-ball work is pretty good, it's a bit like tracking James Milner. You'd think they're inferior because they're less likely to be on the highlight reel as a Chamberlain or a Sturridge, but defensively, they do their bit very well.


Milner is a very very good player.
http://www.liveonlineradio.net/wp-content/themes/Music_Covers/images/music2.gif -------- http://rs648.pbsrc.com/albums/uu204/JeWeL1980_photos/7505xjc54lf3np.gif~c200 -------- http://www.liveonlineradio.net/wp-content/themes/Music_Covers/images/music2.gif
By jumberto | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 17:08 PM
All very good but you named 3 right footed players who will cut inside almost every time, therefore not traditional out and out wingers playing from the left.

I know, but they're still able to beat players and cut inside as you'd like wingers to do from time to time. They're actual wingers, unlike Welbeck, who's a striker. Ideally you'd have left-footed wingers out on the left but we don't have that luxury.
By Telegram Sam | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 17:09 PM
Yes, but he isn't able/ doesn't try to beat players like Walcott or Lennon can, can he?

I'm not slating him, I just don't think he's good enough to be our first-choice left winger as he doesn't possess the qualities to excel in that position - which isn't surprising considering the fact he's been played as a striker for the majority of his career.

I've definitely seen him do it.

http://i.minus.com/ib081dp0xkxNhp.gif
To be honest, it's unlikely two Arsenal fans will have watched as much Welbeck as United fans have so maybe that's why you have these doubts about him. I really think he's going to be absolutely class and he's already a realy good player considering his age.
By jumberto | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 17:19 PM
To be honest, it's unlikely two Arsenal fans will have watched as much Welbeck as United fans have so maybe that's why you have these doubts about him. I really think he's going to be absolutely class and he's already a realy good player considering his age.


I don't think anyone is doubting what he could become. JUST NOT BY PLAYING ON THE LEFT FFS!

«This comment has been edited»
http://www.liveonlineradio.net/wp-content/themes/Music_Covers/images/music2.gif -------- http://rs648.pbsrc.com/albums/uu204/JeWeL1980_photos/7505xjc54lf3np.gif~c200 -------- http://www.liveonlineradio.net/wp-content/themes/Music_Covers/images/music2.gif
But he's played well on the left so this thing you're banging on about is rubbish anyway. Against Tottenham and Liverpool he was fantastic.

Another example of his play on the wing (just messed up the cutback to Kagawa)
http://i.minus.com/ibcefqA53bga1A.gif

«This comment has been edited»
By jumberto | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 17:19 PM
To be honest, it's unlikely two Arsenal fans will have watched as much Welbeck as United fans have so maybe that's why you have these doubts about him. I really think he's going to be absolutely class and he's already a realy good player considering his age.

I haven't seen as much of him this season bar MOTD highlights, but am I right in assuming that when employed on the left-wing, he rarely takes the ball and runs at his man? I've got the impression that this season much of his work on the left has been collecting the ball and cutting inside to link up with Rooney/ van Persie/ whoever, as opposed to trying to beat players and get the cross in.

I'm not doubting his potential, I just feel we'd be better served playing actual wingers on the left and using Welbeck in his best position.
By A Little Bit Of Merson Magic | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 17:09 PM
Muller maybe but he's nothing like the other two players mentioned, he's a centre forward certainly, but for me he offers absolutely nothing when on the left hand side. Not one part of his game is suited to play there and i would say his stats this season prove that.


He's fast, can beat a man and his interplay with others is excellent. He's also got an eye for goal, not one part of his game? Come off it.

And why do we need to have a player on the left that can beat a man(which he can do anyway) and deliver a cross? Who are they crossing to? Rooney. Do Spain and Germany play with out and out wingers on the left? I can't think of many who do actually.
By jumberto | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 17:24 PM
But he's played well on the left so this thing you're banging on about is rubbish anyway. Against Tottenham and Liverpool he was fantastic.

Another example of his play on the wing (just messed up the cutback to Kagawa)
http://i.minus.com/ibcefqA53bga1A.gif


Yeah, the actual important part of the whole move (which if he had actually got his head up would have been a very simple pass). Same as the other gif, gets to the important part where you need that bit of quality, and falls over.
http://www.liveonlineradio.net/wp-content/themes/Music_Covers/images/music2.gif -------- http://rs648.pbsrc.com/albums/uu204/JeWeL1980_photos/7505xjc54lf3np.gif~c200 -------- http://www.liveonlineradio.net/wp-content/themes/Music_Covers/images/music2.gif
No I dont get it either, aside from the fact he can actually do it, the fullbacks provide a lot of width in a 4-2-3-1 anyway.

The fact he's got a great understanding with Cleverley and Rooney is important too.
By A Little Bit Of Merson Magic | Permalink | On 08 February 2013 - 17:34 PM
Yeah, the actual important part of the whole move (which if he had actually got his head up would have been a very simple pass). Same as the other gif, gets to the important part where you need that bit of quality, and falls over.


He's 23, composure and final ball will come with time. In one gif he had just sprinted from the edge of his own box and in the other from the half way line so was probably a bit tired which resulted in what it did.

«This comment has been edited»
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