Number 1
16 years ago
10 months ago
3,650
So you actually believe Wenger to be a specialist in failure?

As much as he has pissed me off over the last few years, i do also realise how hard, in fact almost impossible it is to compete with clubs that spend an almost unlimited amount of money every season. Our net spend since 2003 is around £18m i believe, but we have still 'competed' fairly well in all competitions though of course not actually won anything in 8 years. Chelsea and City's net spend is over £500m in the same period, while Utd's is just over £200m and Liverpool just under. So you would certainly expect those clubs to be at the top every single season.

We're actually placed 17th in the current Prem table by net spend since 2003, yet have every season been in the top 4 and done fairly well in the CL. Now to me that isn't exactly failure.

As for that list of trophies won by Mourniho its obviously very impressive, but when you're managing one of the top 2 sides in the league (3 i guess when starting at Chelsea) and spending millions of £'s each season its not really surprising you're being successful is it?

As a supporter of a team whose last major silverware came one month before Apollo 11 left Earth for the moon, I'd love to be in a position where regular top 4 placings is "specialising in failure".

I think Wenger is harshly picked on to a degree, even if his stubbornness on transfers has often been a problem for the Gunners.
Poe
17 years ago
2 weeks ago
3,675
He spent a pretty penny this season and hasn't really achieved much bar probably an FA Cup.

I think Wenger is a good manager just not one of the worlds elite anymore.
.verse
12 years ago
3 months ago
871
I think the tag sticks due to being at a club that was amongst the top 2 in the league for a period of time and has now seen them regress, partly due to this refusal to spend money like those around him. He's been extremely lucky that Arsenal have stuck with him because there certainly isn't many clubs around of the stature of Arsenal which would stick with a manager who hasn't won something in so long.

It's getting to the point where if Wenger and Arsenal aren't careful the likes of Spurs and Everton will overtake them in the coming years. We've already seen the gap close over the last couple, particularly with Spurs, who will continue to spend.
Based Jorge
10 years ago
3 years ago
1,399
He spent a pretty penny this season and hasn't really achieved much bar probably an FA Cup.

I think Wenger is a good manager just not one of the worlds elite anymore.


His stubbornness is his downfall. Spent too long dwelling on the 'youth project' that the best players in that period left for greener pastures. He plays the same tactics every game, regardless of opposition. He's quoted as saying that the last time he changed tactics because of opposition was against United in the FA Cup final in 2005. We won that match, but he said it went against his philosophies so he's refused to do it ever since.

You just can't do that at the top level, especially when you have teams that are much better than you above you.
Jamieandhisego
17 years ago
1 year ago
841
His stubbornness is his downfall. Spent too long dwelling on the 'youth project' that the best players in that period left for greener pastures. He plays the same tactics every game, regardless of opposition. He's quoted as saying that the last time he changed tactics because of opposition was against United in the FA Cup final in 2005. We won that match, but he said it went against his philosophies so he's refused to do it ever since.

You just can't do that at the top level, especially when you have teams that are much better than you above you.


In fairness to him, it's because it really didn't work. United had 20 shots on target in that game, Arsenal had none and they won on penalties. Wenger, to his credit, recognised that if he'd played that way 9/10 they would have been spanked, and he's beaten United since on multiple occasions playing some (unfortunately for us) cracking stuff.
Telegram Sam
15 years ago
5 months ago
5,082
Premium
I think the tag sticks due to being at a club that was amongst the top 2 in the league for a period of time and has now seen them regress, partly due to this refusal to spend money like those around him. He's been extremely lucky that Arsenal have stuck with him because there certainly isn't many clubs around of the stature of Arsenal which would stick with a manager who hasn't won something in so long.

It's getting to the point where if Wenger and Arsenal aren't careful the likes of Spurs and Everton will overtake them in the coming years. We've already seen the gap close over the last couple, particularly with Spurs, who will continue to spend.

The biggest downfall for Wenger was that he didn't account for Chelsea and City being bought out by billionaires. He knew that during the time that Ashburton was being built that we would have to tighten the pursestrings, but in the early noughties you could get by with £10m signings with potential. Chelsea changed the game and City had a similar effect a few years later. He's made plenty of mistakes and we certainly could have been more adventurous with our spending but I think Wenger's work is hugely under-appreciated. People love to bang on about going nine years without a trophy, which is obviously pretty shit, but you musn't forget that he took us to a Champions League final in 2006, two domestic cup finals and we've mounted a few title challenges in that time. It's frustrating that we've fallen away so often but we have been more competitive than people like to think.

It's funny how this thing about Spurs catching us warning keeps coming up, yet despite being in incredible positions to finally finish ahead of us in 2011/12 and 2012/13 they blew it both times. Those were their best chances. We're now in a position where we can spend more than we have in recent seasons and Spurs blew all of their Bale money last summer. The gap between ourselves and Spurs is bigger than it was a season ago and it will only grow bigger. Everton have done well this season but don't have the resources to challenge for the top four year after year.
.verse
12 years ago
3 months ago
871
The biggest downfall for Wenger was that he didn't account for Chelsea and City being bought out by billionaires. He knew that during the time that Ashburton was being built that we would have to tighten the pursestrings, but in the early noughties you could get by with £10m signings with potential. Chelsea changed the game and City had a similar effect a few years later. He's made plenty of mistakes and we certainly could have been more adventurous with our spending but I think Wenger's work is hugely under-appreciated. People love to bang on about going nine years without a trophy, which is obviously pretty shit, but you musn't forget that he took us to a Champions League final in 2006, two domestic cup finals and we've mounted a few title challenges in that time. It's frustrating that we've fallen away so often but we have been more competitive than people like to think.

It's funny how this thing about Spurs catching us warning keeps coming up, yet despite being in incredible positions to finally finish ahead of us in 2011/12 and 2012/13 they blew it both times. Those were their best chances. We're now in a position where we can spend more than we have in recent seasons and Spurs blew all of their Bale money last summer. The gap between ourselves and Spurs is bigger than it was a season ago and it will only grow bigger. Everton have done well this season but don't have the resources to challenge for the top four year after year.

Naturally a fair point regarding Chelsea and Man City being taken over. That's hard to counter when you're aware of it. In saying that though, once it did happen and the sort of money that was being spent, it should have made Wenger more aware of what was to come and that he would need to be more aggressive in the transfer market to maintain the level Arsenal were already at.

While he's done well in remaining competitive and putting together a few runs deep into a competition or title race, his stubbornness in replacing the loss of some crucial and experienced players, like Adams and Vieira, with players who had already developed and established themselves was a novice mistake. This set Arsenal back a number of years while Wenger plugged away with his little project players for a few years before he eventually cast them aside. You could also argue that it also cost the club some silverware during that period because they lacked that experience to ultimately finish the job. And I think you raised the biggest key point; While Arsenal have remained competitive, it hasn't lead to anything more than that. Which is where the issue lies. Given the statue of the club simply being competitive isn't enough, you need to win something at least once every 2-3 years minimum to keep that winning mentality. You certainly could't see other top clubs being content to allow a manager 8 unsuccessful years.
Carroll.
15 years ago
3 years ago
3,361
Thinking of betting on Real, surely its the year they finally do it. But knowing them theyll fuck up
Shedender
17 years ago
1 month ago
13,751
I already have done so the cunts better win.

'mon Cristiano and co.
Telegram Sam
15 years ago
5 months ago
5,082
Premium
I'm not fussed who wins, I like both teams - just hope for a good game.
Crane
14 years ago
3 weeks ago
2,432
Premium
I hope for a good game but would prefer Atletico to win.
Sam
17 years ago
1 year ago
5,092
Costa subbed off after only nine minutes.
King Luis
17 years ago
1 month ago
3,111
Stupid decision from Atletico to play Costa when he quite obviously wasn't fit
Telegram Sam
15 years ago
5 months ago
5,082
Premium
Cynical as fuck from Raul Garcia.
Eric Portapotty
14 years ago
1 week ago
3,322
Casillas done fucked up there.
Sam
17 years ago
1 year ago
5,092
GOAL! Atletico.

Oh Casillas.
Crane
14 years ago
3 weeks ago
2,432
Premium
Tiago looks like an extra from the film Troy.
Jason
17 years ago
1 month ago
4,635
http://sport365.hu/files/upload/mourinho%20nevet.jpg

"I told you so..."
Telegram Sam
15 years ago
5 months ago
5,082
Premium
http://sport365.hu/files/upload/mourinho%20nevet.jpg

"I told you so..."

I don't get it.
Crane
14 years ago
3 weeks ago
2,432
Premium
Eric Portapotty
14 years ago
1 week ago
3,322
Real will concede another before they score, imo.
Eric Portapotty
14 years ago
1 week ago
3,322
100 million for 3 shots off target and a handball.
Jason
17 years ago
1 month ago
4,635
Eric Portapotty
14 years ago
1 week ago
3,322
Bale's choked this properly badly.
Sam
17 years ago
1 year ago
5,092
GOAL! 1-1.

Heartbreak for Atletico.
Telegram Sam
15 years ago
5 months ago
5,082
Premium
GET IN

I would have felt cheated if it had ended 1-0. Would have been such an anti-climax.
King Luis
17 years ago
1 month ago
3,111
What a finish from Ramos as well, great header
George14brfc
12 years ago
3 years ago
3,912
Jason
17 years ago
1 month ago
4,635
That goal won me £6, so i've put the £6 that that goal won on Madrid to win in ET, that'll win me £25, if that wins i'll put that £25 on Rotherham to win tomorrow which could win me £75, if it happens, it'll be the start of a brilliant night.

I'm now supporting Real Madrid, not Athletico, unless it goes to pens in which case i want Athletico to win
Sam
17 years ago
1 year ago
5,092
GOAL! 2-1 Real.

About time Bale, you had enough chances.

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