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#361414 2016/17 Barclays Premier League Thread
Ninja
C'mon Jorge don't leave us hanging. Common what?
#361408 2016/17 Barclays Premier League Thread
Ninja
Add 'spineless bunch of cunts' and that sums it up really.
#359075 2016/17 Barclays Premier League Thread
Ninja
#358152 The Night Thread Mk. IX
Ninja
The last sentence is true, but I believe they were much more likely to vote for Obama than they were for Clinton which could well skew swing data.
The interesting question here though is how unusual those swings are. All these tables have democrats first.
For references sake here is Obama's numbers from 2008.
Under $15,000 73 25 2 6
$15,000–30,000 60 37 3 12
$30,000–50,000 55 43 2 19
$50,000–75,000 48 49 3 21
$75,000–100,000 51 48 1 15
$100,000–150,000 48 51 1 14
$150,000–200,000 48 50 1 6
Over $200,000 52 46 2 6
and 2008
Under $30,000 63 35 2 20
$30,000–49,999 57 42 1 21
$50,000–99,999 46 52 2 31
$100,000–199,999 44 54 2 21
$200,000–249,999 47 52 1 3
Over $250,000 42 55 3 4
even compared to Bush's 2000 numbers theres not a massive amount of difference to his income vote breakdown to Trump's.
<$15,000
58
38
1
4
$15,000-29,999
54
42
1
3
$30-49,999
49
48
1
2
$50-74,999
46
51
1
2
$75-99,999
46
52
*
2
$100,000 & over
43
55
*
3
Even going back to Clinton in 92 there's not a huge amount to suggest that Trump did anything unusual:
11 Under $15,000 58 23 19 59 28 11
23 $15,000–29,999 45 35 20 53 36 9
27 $30,000–49,999 41 38 21 48 40 10
39 Over $50,000 39 44 17 44 48 7
18 Over $75,000 36 48 16 41 51 7
9 Over $100,000 — — — 38 54 6
Now all of these graphs subdivide the data in a way the original didn't, but I think its reasonably clear that the huge swing is more about Obama getting people out to vote in ways Clinton couldn't and didn't than it is about Trump. And that there is always a swing against the ruling party towards the other in the poorest of society.
#358107 The Night Thread Mk. IX
Ninja
Well apparently more poor and working class people voted for her than him so maybe?
I don't actually know though. Her entire campaign seemed to be 'I'm not as shit as him' which is true but obviously uninspiring.
#358050 The Night Thread Mk. IX
Ninja
Thats fine. I was offering it up as a criticism of that line of thinking, but not necessarily a criticism of you.
I just doesn't really stack up with reality though. Trump won because he won the states he needed to. He's set to lose the popular vote (bearing in mind all votes haven't been counted yet) by abut 3 million votes and his vote share is roughly in line with previous Republican candidates; the result is a long, long way from a decisive rejection of the Democratic party or Clinton or an embrace of Trump's rhetoric but, more simply, a Republican candidate performing roughly as expected in the US system.
Whilst it is obviously upsetting to see a man who has said and done what he has done being voted into the White House and he did pick up the protest vote, but as a representative of the party not in power he's bound to pick up the protest vote regardless of what he says, the idea that the actual results of the election show that Trump galvanised his supporters doesn't really stack up.
And case in point here's a tweet showing ad campaigns in two swing states Trump won. The Clinton campaign got complacent and spent its money on stupid places they weren't going to win leaving Trump free to chip away at states they should have been targeting.
For all the talk about 'new' politics Trump won it for some very old reasons.
#358002 The Night Thread Mk. IX
Ninja
Maybe they shouldn't vote for someone thats all of those things then?
On the subject, its a bit hypocritical to claim the high ground about how 'liberals' made you do X Y and Z because they offended you and then attempt to disparage 'liberals' as a collective and use it as a dirty word.
Not exactly particularly conciliatory.
#356623 2016/17 Barclays Premier League Thread
Ninja
Wouldn't be amazed if we contrived to throw it away, the scoreline massively flatters us.
#356589 2016/17 Barclays Premier League Thread
Ninja
#355789 2016/17 Europa League
Ninja
There's not really a 'general' view I can give you. When we start losing games everything gets burnt and people lose objectivity.
I think people (and I include myself in this although I did whinge about our attacking options a lot last years) are realising that the squad is worse than we thought. Huge amounts of money have been squandered on players who either technically or mentally aren't up to playing for United.
Although I think Mourinho identified the problem areas and bought a better calibre of player and he's saying and doing the right things but the problem with United since Ferguson retired has been one step forward and two, maybe three, back.
As for time, he'll get sacked if he doesn't get CL football. Maybe this season as a grace period.
#355730 2016/17 Europa League
Ninja
Fuck me, its almost impressive how much we've spent accumulating shite over the years.
#354855 2016/17 Barclays Premier League Thread
Ninja
I don't think theres need for any elaborate theories on plans with Zlatan yet. He looks fit and his link up and hold up play (apart from the first 45 minutes against City mid-week) have been excellent, his understanding with Pogba and particularly Mata has been good and getting better all the time and I do think he's been a big reason why we suddenly look more fluid going forward.
He's just going through a patch at the minute where he can't hit a cows arse with a banjo, but its weird, he'll miss the ball two yards out in front of goal into an open net but then somehow manages to twist and contort himself to absolutely rocket the ball goal wards only for Heaton to pull off an absolutely unbelievable save.
So I dunno, I'm inclined to think that he's just going through a spell of being a bit unlucky in front of goal and things just aren't working for him.
#354806 2016/17 Barclays Premier League Thread
Ninja
Pretty much all season truth be told. If he'd taken his chances we'd be at the very least about 7 points better off. Possibly more. No wonder Sweden are shit.
Fuck me, its tempting to say 'ah well we were unlucky and it was just one of those days' but when two people you're paying a combined half a million to every week can't hit the target from two yards out you don't deserve shit.
#354240 2016/17 EFL Cup (League Cup!)
Ninja
Pep's ode to Van Gaal tonight. More of the ball, but no incision, no intent, no pace, no shots on target.
In fairness I never thought Pep's job would be difficult here because City couldn't play good football, on the contrary, they probably played the best stuff in the league when they could be arsed but to drill into his side a winning mentality and consistency. I'm not sure he's shown anything so far to suggest that he can do that yet, but its a process to borrow a Van Gaal-ism and he was never going to be able to do that over night.
#354210 2016/17 EFL Cup (League Cup!)
Ninja
#354192 2016/17 EFL Cup (League Cup!)
Ninja
Mourinho said he wasn't injured last week.
It was always a ridiculously risky transfer and one we should have avoided. It took him 3 seasons to settle in at Dortmund and I saw more shite performances from him in those games than I think I saw from any other supposedly 'good' player in my life (even Rooney) in that time. When he was bad he was really bad.
I suppose you have to say its early and you should give him time, but I said when we first linked to him I'd like to see us sign a better calibre of player and I was worried abut his mentality and how he would cope, so I'm not surprised to see him struggling.
#354187 2016/17 EFL Cup (League Cup!)
Ninja
#353518 2016/17 Barclays Premier League Thread
Ninja
#353488 2016/17 Barclays Premier League Thread
Ninja
And christ, I've been a fan of his, but fuck me if Smalling wasn't at fault in someway for all of them.
#353462 2016/17 Barclays Premier League Thread
Ninja
#353443 The Lower League Thread
Ninja
Ah, didn't realise they played mid-week. Heard it on the radio during the 0-0 draw of theirs last weekend.
I can sympathise; must be a lot like watching us last season.
#353440 The Lower League Thread
Ninja
Is it something like 7 games in a row now they haven't scored? They got good money for Daryl Murphy given his age but replacing him with Leon Best hardly seems like the best business
#352672 2016/17 Europa League
Ninja
#352283 2016/17 Barclays Premier League Thread
Ninja
Yet despite all that I would argue that the best chance of the game fell to Ibra who made a catastrophic pigs ear of it and who arguably should have scored but, at the very least, should have hit the target. For all your supposed attacking intent the sum total of your efforts were two decent saves from De Gea from little more than half chances.
Seems for all the laughing at Van Gaal last season Liverpool fans are relying on the Van Gaal definition of attacking. We were as content to allow you to have lots of the ball in non-dangerous areas as you were to have the ball there, but there was little to suggest you tried to force the issue. You dominated possession, sure, but I don't think there was anything to suggest you were anymore willing to risk losing to force the issue than we were. We had lots of those games last season as teams realised that we'd pick them off if they opened up but we couldn't break them down when they sat deeper, its a perfectly valid tactic and one that cost us a lot of points over the season. Only being able to beat teams that play into your hands would suggest you're just not as good a side as people would have you believe.
#351932 2016/17 Barclays Premier League Thread
Ninja
Not really I thought they showed at half time how well we were setting up and what we were doing to counter specific threats (although I would argue that Ander Herrera's best game in a United shirt was probably a far more important factor than anything shape wise he was everywhere).
But yeah, in general I do just think it was a general lack of quality rather than anything else that saw this game finish 0-0. If Pogba and Ibra had performed anything like they're capable of we'd have looked a lot less toothless going forward.
In general I'm reasonably encouraged by the last few weeks though, we put 4 past Leicester, should have put about 6 against Stoke and actually turned up and executed a game plan in a big game. The points might not necessarily reflect it but I think we've demonstrably improved our performances since the start of the season. Hopefully once Mkhyitaran comes in we'll go up a gear again, but I'm not holding my breath.
#351746 2016/17 Barclays Premier League Thread
Ninja
Baffles me how we can spunk £600m and still play Ashley fucking Young.
#349152 The England National Team
Ninja
Not that I don't doubt that all those are probably dodgy, but the Telegraph's exposed a series of small frys since Fat Sam and I don't think they have much on anyone else.
#349102 2016/17 Europa League
Ninja
Did you actually see how shit it was though?
Not that I don't agree with your general point but, yeah, that was really shit.
#348760 The Night Thread Mk. IX
Ninja
See this is the problem with Corbyn. Although I don't agree with him on much of foreign policy he actually has a relatively nuanced outlook to it which often times boils down to 'Lets not make the same mistakes we always make and lets not make the problem worse' which gets completely misrepresented by a hawkish and right wing media.
Anyway, Corbyn's biggest problem for me has always been the constant undermining of his position by Labour MP's. If they stopped telling everybody that would listen that he's 'unelectable' then the electorate as a whole might not have bought into the idea so readily.
Might not be enough to win an election, but if the biggest problem with Corbyn is electability and competence then the PLP shouldn't have put up a more incompetent and unelectable candidate in Smith.
#348588 2016/17 Barclays Premier League Thread
Ninja
I'm absolutely certain that Gray's comments would have got him done under a general 'bringing the game into disrepute' rule even if social media wasn't specifically regulated. And well, his comments were disgraceful so he deserves it.